Comments on: Would a 4 cylinder diesel engine make sense in the U.S. market? http://www.bmwblog.com/2009/08/23/would-a-4-cylinder-diesel-engine-make-sense-in-the-us-market/ BMW News, Reviews, Test Drives, Photos And Videos Mon, 13 Feb 2012 18:30:58 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Doug http://www.bmwblog.com/2009/08/23/would-a-4-cylinder-diesel-engine-make-sense-in-the-us-market/#comment-285185 Doug Fri, 12 Nov 2010 14:02:13 +0000 http://www.bmwblog.com/?p=18962#comment-285185 I had to check the mileage to see. 50mpg is excellent... but why is it so much better than the 335d @36mpg ?? The city mileage disparity is similar. I had to check the mileage to see. 50mpg is excellent… but why is it so much better than the 335d @36mpg ?? The city mileage disparity is similar.

]]> By: Joel Davila http://www.bmwblog.com/2009/08/23/would-a-4-cylinder-diesel-engine-make-sense-in-the-us-market/#comment-284958 Joel Davila Fri, 12 Nov 2010 03:01:23 +0000 http://www.bmwblog.com/?p=18962#comment-284958 Oh, before I forget, diesel engines enjoy a historic and proven technology over electric/battery operated cars. Hey, I like the way this came out: a battery operated passenger car! It tastes the it sounds. Don't get me wrong, if you prefer Duracell, more power to you! Hey, I like how this one came out too!:a Duracell battery operated passenger car! OH god, having too much fun here. BMW, bring it on. I'm sending you guys a check as a down payment for that first 320d. Oh, before I forget, diesel engines enjoy a historic and proven technology over electric/battery operated cars. Hey, I like the way this came out: a battery operated passenger car! It tastes the it sounds. Don’t get me wrong, if you prefer Duracell, more power to you! Hey, I like how this one came out too!:a Duracell battery operated passenger car! OH god, having too much fun here. BMW, bring it on. I’m sending you guys a check as a down payment for that first 320d.

]]> By: Joel Davila http://www.bmwblog.com/2009/08/23/would-a-4-cylinder-diesel-engine-make-sense-in-the-us-market/#comment-284954 Joel Davila Fri, 12 Nov 2010 02:53:52 +0000 http://www.bmwblog.com/?p=18962#comment-284954 I'm a current driver and owner of a 09 Jetta TDI and absolutely love it. The car was engineered to succeed! If VW can hit the nail on the head with this car, imaging what BMW could do introducing a 3 series model with a turbo charged 4 cyl engine. I would probably sleep at the gate of the dealership to put my hands on the first one. In fact, I do have my eyes on the 335d as we speak. Right now I love getting the 40+ average MPG on the Jetta. BMW, hello, BMW, a 4 cyl turbo charged 3 series car for the US is a no-brainer!!!!! I’m a current driver and owner of a 09 Jetta TDI and absolutely love it. The car was engineered to succeed! If VW can hit the nail on the head with this car, imaging what BMW could do introducing a 3 series model with a turbo charged 4 cyl engine. I would probably sleep at the gate of the dealership to put my hands on the first one. In fact, I do have my eyes on the 335d as we speak. Right now I love getting the 40+ average MPG on the Jetta. BMW, hello, BMW, a 4 cyl turbo charged 3 series car for the US is a no-brainer!!!!!

]]> By: Jeffery Haas http://www.bmwblog.com/2009/08/23/would-a-4-cylinder-diesel-engine-make-sense-in-the-us-market/#comment-232065 Jeffery Haas Sun, 27 Jun 2010 17:41:24 +0000 http://www.bmwblog.com/?p=18962#comment-232065 Much of what you refer is centered around the luxury/sport market, and that part of the market is more than saturated. The average American is stuck in traffic in mind-numbing commutes to work and back, hauling kids around or driving long distances as part of their job, and THAT part of the market has been ignored for decades, to the extreme pleasure of the oil companies, who do not want to see a doubling of fuel efficiency across the board for this larger market segment. Much of what you refer is centered around the luxury/sport market, and that part of the market is more than saturated.
The average American is stuck in traffic in mind-numbing commutes to work and back, hauling kids around or driving long distances as part of their job, and THAT part of the market has been ignored for decades, to the extreme pleasure of the oil companies, who do not want to see a doubling of fuel efficiency across the board for this larger market segment.

]]> By: Jeffery Haas http://www.bmwblog.com/2009/08/23/would-a-4-cylinder-diesel-engine-make-sense-in-the-us-market/#comment-232063 Jeffery Haas Sun, 27 Jun 2010 17:36:41 +0000 http://www.bmwblog.com/?p=18962#comment-232063 Anyone who still thinks that small and efficient diesel engine cars and light trucks are not appropriate for the US market is either extremely ignorant or working for the oil companies, END OF DISCUSSION. Anyone who still thinks that small and efficient diesel engine cars and light trucks are not appropriate for the US market is either extremely ignorant or working for the oil companies, END OF DISCUSSION.

]]> By: NELS http://www.bmwblog.com/2009/08/23/would-a-4-cylinder-diesel-engine-make-sense-in-the-us-market/#comment-220186 NELS Tue, 18 May 2010 09:50:58 +0000 http://www.bmwblog.com/?p=18962#comment-220186 Iv been hunting every where for a small diesel for a daily driver. diesel is way more reliable, better options for alternative fuel, andmore bang for your buck. most gas engines cant do what a diesel does...... i think all the auto makers should provide diesel cars and small pickups not luxery and not all working size vehicles. make em friendly for the daily consumer!!! Iv been hunting every where for a small diesel for a daily driver. diesel is way more reliable, better options for alternative fuel, andmore bang for your buck. most gas engines cant do what a diesel does…… i think all the auto makers should provide diesel cars and small pickups not luxery and not all working size vehicles.
make em friendly for the daily consumer!!!

]]> By: David http://www.bmwblog.com/2009/08/23/would-a-4-cylinder-diesel-engine-make-sense-in-the-us-market/#comment-193226 David Sun, 21 Feb 2010 20:06:59 +0000 http://www.bmwblog.com/?p=18962#comment-193226 When the gas crunch came on the scene in the early 70's, Ford bought BMW 6's to put in Lincolns but I am not sure it ever was finalized due the lead time it took to acclimate the two. GM rushed the 5.9 and then the 6.2 in Oldsmobiles, I had to work on them, a real nightmare. VW took the engineers approach and worked it all out, now look what they are doing! I have seen older 1.6 turbo diesels (VW) get over 60 MPG on long flat runs across the SW USA! The new TDi's are amazing and powerful enough to put into a "sports car". Most european manufactures have had incentives to build small econo-boxes for years. We in the States, tax the hell out of diesel fuel due to the trucking industry and make the fuel too expensive to consider as an alternative to gasoline. I would buy a diesel golf if I could find one I could afford. Or how about a hybrid diesel electric...VW is working on a production car now, I hear. Hmmmm. Controled engine operation to minimize pollutants, and power to run a generator, almost sounds like a Chevy Volt? When the gas crunch came on the scene in the early 70′s, Ford bought BMW 6′s to put in Lincolns but I am not sure it ever was finalized due the lead time it took to acclimate the two. GM rushed the 5.9 and then the 6.2 in Oldsmobiles, I had to work on them, a real nightmare. VW took the engineers approach and worked it all out, now look what they are doing! I have seen older 1.6 turbo diesels (VW) get over 60 MPG on long flat runs across the SW USA! The new TDi’s are amazing and powerful enough to put into a “sports car”. Most european manufactures have had incentives to build small econo-boxes for years. We in the States, tax the hell out of diesel fuel due to the trucking industry and make the fuel too expensive to consider as an alternative to gasoline. I would buy a diesel golf if I could find one I could afford. Or how about a hybrid diesel electric…VW is working on a production car now, I hear. Hmmmm. Controled engine operation to minimize pollutants, and power to run a generator, almost sounds like a Chevy Volt?

]]> By: Kayaxeman http://www.bmwblog.com/2009/08/23/would-a-4-cylinder-diesel-engine-make-sense-in-the-us-market/#comment-149088 Kayaxeman Thu, 03 Sep 2009 03:55:12 +0000 http://www.bmwblog.com/?p=18962#comment-149088 I drive a '98 318i (last of the 4 cylinder American BMWs) and love it. Previously, I had a 4 cylinder 320i (1980). These are just great cars. I wrote and called BMW numerous times concerning their release of the European 1 series in the States, and they pretty much said "Americans won't buy 4 cylinder cars, or hatchbacks". I'd love to make my next car a 120d. We need to make some noise. I drive a ’98 318i (last of the 4 cylinder American BMWs) and love it. Previously, I had a 4 cylinder 320i (1980). These are just great cars. I wrote and called BMW numerous times concerning their release of the European 1 series in the States, and they pretty much said “Americans won’t buy 4 cylinder cars, or hatchbacks”. I’d love to make my next car a 120d. We need to make some noise.

]]> By: Doug http://www.bmwblog.com/2009/08/23/would-a-4-cylinder-diesel-engine-make-sense-in-the-us-market/#comment-147649 Doug Fri, 28 Aug 2009 16:43:34 +0000 http://www.bmwblog.com/?p=18962#comment-147649 Because the vast majority of cars have automatic transmissions, which most people have learned on. Manual transmissions are less desired except in niche situations like saving a few hundred dollars or you are a true sports car enthusiast. Moreover, how can you talk on a cel, drink coffee, or put on lipstick if you are constantly jiggling the shifter? Because the vast majority of cars have automatic transmissions, which most people have learned on. Manual transmissions are less desired except in niche situations like saving a few hundred dollars or you are a true sports car enthusiast.

Moreover, how can you talk on a cel, drink coffee, or put on lipstick if you are constantly jiggling the shifter?

]]> By: Doug http://www.bmwblog.com/2009/08/23/would-a-4-cylinder-diesel-engine-make-sense-in-the-us-market/#comment-147623 Doug Fri, 28 Aug 2009 14:24:35 +0000 http://www.bmwblog.com/?p=18962#comment-147623 edit: diesels are noisier without *extra* vibration and acoustic damping to compensate. edit: diesels are noisier without *extra* vibration and acoustic damping to compensate.

]]> By: Doug http://www.bmwblog.com/2009/08/23/would-a-4-cylinder-diesel-engine-make-sense-in-the-us-market/#comment-147622 Doug Fri, 28 Aug 2009 14:22:31 +0000 http://www.bmwblog.com/?p=18962#comment-147622 Americans just want more powerful cars than europeans, it's just part of our automotive heritage and culture. Petrol engines have the performance and characteristics we're used to and like. Having driven some diesels, I can't say I'm fond of the experience. They can be fairly quiet and smooth, but fundamentally, diesels *are* noiser and rougher vibration & acoustic damping etc.. They also sound gross, subjectively speaking. So I have several questions about diesel: 1) While delivering considerably more torque, the actual acceleration performance (eg 0-60) doesn't seem to increase noticeably. Is this because the benefits are only at low speeds where the lower horsepower has an easier time overcoming resistance? 2) While diesel delivers 40% less fuel consumption when hypermiled, what efficiency gains (over gas) does it give when driven all-out, where consumption rises exponentially? 3) Can the US supply chain and points of sale actually accommodate a large shift toward consumer diesels? If not, is that capital investment better allocated to other strategies with similar [altruistic] goals? Americans just want more powerful cars than europeans, it’s just part of our automotive heritage and culture. Petrol engines have the performance and characteristics we’re used to and like.

Having driven some diesels, I can’t say I’m fond of the experience. They can be fairly quiet and smooth, but fundamentally, diesels *are* noiser and rougher vibration & acoustic damping etc.. They also sound gross, subjectively speaking.

So I have several questions about diesel:

1) While delivering considerably more torque, the actual acceleration performance (eg 0-60) doesn’t seem to increase noticeably. Is this because the benefits are only at low speeds where the lower horsepower has an easier time overcoming resistance?

2) While diesel delivers 40% less fuel consumption when hypermiled, what efficiency gains (over gas) does it give when driven all-out, where consumption rises exponentially?

3) Can the US supply chain and points of sale actually accommodate a large shift toward consumer diesels? If not, is that capital investment better allocated to other strategies with similar [altruistic] goals?

]]> By: PVF http://www.bmwblog.com/2009/08/23/would-a-4-cylinder-diesel-engine-make-sense-in-the-us-market/#comment-146919 PVF Wed, 26 Aug 2009 03:25:34 +0000 http://www.bmwblog.com/?p=18962#comment-146919 The same way I don´t understand why in USA people don´t know how to drive Manual Gears...Could someone explain? The same way I don´t understand why in USA people don´t know how to drive Manual Gears…Could someone explain?

]]> By: jkp http://www.bmwblog.com/2009/08/23/would-a-4-cylinder-diesel-engine-make-sense-in-the-us-market/#comment-146915 jkp Wed, 26 Aug 2009 03:10:44 +0000 http://www.bmwblog.com/?p=18962#comment-146915 Yes, it makes a hell of a lot of sense. In fact, I don't see BMW having much of a choice if it wants to meet the new CAFE standards. In any event, a reasonably-priced 1er coupe or 3er sedan or X1 with the 4-cyl turbodiesel from the European 123d would go a long way toward convincing Americans that fuel efficient engines needn't be a return to the dismal 1970s. Yes, it makes a hell of a lot of sense. In fact, I don’t see BMW having much of a choice if it wants to meet the new CAFE standards.

In any event, a reasonably-priced 1er coupe or 3er sedan or X1 with the 4-cyl turbodiesel from the European 123d would go a long way toward convincing Americans that fuel efficient engines needn’t be a return to the dismal 1970s.

]]> By: michael http://www.bmwblog.com/2009/08/23/would-a-4-cylinder-diesel-engine-make-sense-in-the-us-market/#comment-146857 michael Tue, 25 Aug 2009 21:38:18 +0000 http://www.bmwblog.com/?p=18962#comment-146857 Gord - the BMW diesels aren't just for quiet bumbling around town. They are still BMWs to the core ;) take the 330d for example. http://www.themotorreport.com.au/13687/2009-bmw-330d-on-its-way-to-australia/ "Powered by a six-cylinder 3.0 litre turbo-diesel engine, the 330d provides V8 rivaling torque with efficiency akin to a four-cylinder. In fact, with 520Nm on tap from just 1750rpm, the turbo-diesel motor is even gruntier than the M3’s 4.0 litre V8. The new generation all-aluminium engine pumps out 180kWs and a huge 520Nms. Peak power is reached at 4,000 rpm but peak torque is available from as low as 1,750 rpm and up to 3,000 rpm. The 330d is only available with a six-speed automatic transmission. Returning fuel efficiency figures of 6.8L/100kms and emissions of 180 g/km, the 330d will incur less Luxury Car Tax (LCT) as a result. These figures, combined with the Beamer’s stump-pulling torque, should make it a popular additon to the updated 3-Series range." I think part of the misconception that a lot of people have is that fuel-efficient = boring. I think BMW is trying to disprove that. Look at the ActiveHybrid X6 as an example as well. But I'd be curious to know the price differential between diesel and regular fuel in the US. Part of the Australian experience is that when fuel prices skyrocket - sales of diesel cars also increase. Gord – the BMW diesels aren’t just for quiet bumbling around town. They are still BMWs to the core ;)

take the 330d for example.
http://www.themotorreport.com.au/13687/2009-bmw-330d-on-its-way-to-australia/

“Powered by a six-cylinder 3.0 litre turbo-diesel engine, the 330d provides V8 rivaling torque with efficiency akin to a four-cylinder. In fact, with 520Nm on tap from just 1750rpm, the turbo-diesel motor is even gruntier than the M3’s 4.0 litre V8.

The new generation all-aluminium engine pumps out 180kWs and a huge 520Nms. Peak power is reached at 4,000 rpm but peak torque is available from as low as 1,750 rpm and up to 3,000 rpm. The 330d is only available with a six-speed automatic transmission.

Returning fuel efficiency figures of 6.8L/100kms and emissions of 180 g/km, the 330d will incur less Luxury Car Tax (LCT) as a result. These figures, combined with the Beamer’s stump-pulling torque, should make it a popular additon to the updated 3-Series range.”

I think part of the misconception that a lot of people have is that fuel-efficient = boring. I think BMW is trying to disprove that. Look at the ActiveHybrid X6 as an example as well.

But I’d be curious to know the price differential between diesel and regular fuel in the US. Part of the Australian experience is that when fuel prices skyrocket – sales of diesel cars also increase.

]]> By: badger http://www.bmwblog.com/2009/08/23/would-a-4-cylinder-diesel-engine-make-sense-in-the-us-market/#comment-146503 badger Mon, 24 Aug 2009 21:48:52 +0000 http://www.bmwblog.com/?p=18962#comment-146503 of course it would make sense! Diesel would at least help car makers to start thinking of making more fuel efficient vehicles. of course it would make sense!
Diesel would at least help car makers to start
thinking of making more fuel efficient vehicles.

]]> By: PVF http://www.bmwblog.com/2009/08/23/would-a-4-cylinder-diesel-engine-make-sense-in-the-us-market/#comment-146422 PVF Mon, 24 Aug 2009 16:04:49 +0000 http://www.bmwblog.com/?p=18962#comment-146422 I have a 2009 BMW E92...320d...it is fast and it eats the road when I push him in a climb! Diesel engines have HUGE POWER...You should try one...and if they aren´t sold in the US...hey, come here to Europe, buy one and import them to you country! Altought i´m only 24 years old I can assure you...DIESEL RULLES IN EUROPE FOR SOME REASON! ;) I have a 2009 BMW E92…320d…it is fast and it eats the road when I push him in a climb! Diesel engines have HUGE POWER…You should try one…and if they aren´t sold in the US…hey, come here to Europe, buy one and import them to you country! Altought i´m only 24 years old I can assure you…DIESEL RULLES IN EUROPE FOR SOME REASON! ;)

]]> By: viper http://www.bmwblog.com/2009/08/23/would-a-4-cylinder-diesel-engine-make-sense-in-the-us-market/#comment-146420 viper Mon, 24 Aug 2009 16:01:25 +0000 http://www.bmwblog.com/?p=18962#comment-146420 I dont understand why wouldnt they?...if they are good for europenas who have better roads than in the US also less furl consuption and more torque...it should be good for everyone especially for US I dont understand why wouldnt they?…if they are good for europenas who have better roads than in the US also less furl consuption and more torque…it should be good for everyone especially for US

]]> By: Parker Despain http://www.bmwblog.com/2009/08/23/would-a-4-cylinder-diesel-engine-make-sense-in-the-us-market/#comment-146407 Parker Despain Mon, 24 Aug 2009 14:32:28 +0000 http://www.bmwblog.com/?p=18962#comment-146407 BMW bring the 320d! I will buy one :D BMW bring the 320d! I will buy one :D

]]> By: Gord http://www.bmwblog.com/2009/08/23/would-a-4-cylinder-diesel-engine-make-sense-in-the-us-market/#comment-146384 Gord Mon, 24 Aug 2009 12:30:45 +0000 http://www.bmwblog.com/?p=18962#comment-146384 I think the 4 cylinder diesels are fine for America. Not everyone needs a fast car, most probably just want a quiet car to bumble about daily and for the occasional vacation. And since the 4 cyclinder is less expensive than a 6 cylinder, the difference can be used for extra goodies. I think the 4 cylinder diesels are fine for America.

Not everyone needs a fast car, most probably just want a quiet car to bumble about daily and for the occasional vacation.

And since the 4 cyclinder is less expensive than a 6 cylinder, the difference can be used for extra goodies.

]]> By: Johann Plessis http://www.bmwblog.com/2009/08/23/would-a-4-cylinder-diesel-engine-make-sense-in-the-us-market/#comment-146362 Johann Plessis Mon, 24 Aug 2009 10:24:53 +0000 http://www.bmwblog.com/?p=18962#comment-146362 I can't see why Americans would not embrace these cars once they are introduced. I currently drive an E46 320d, and it is awesome. It is still seen as a premium car where I live (South Africa), even though it is 5 years old by now. It's NOT dirty, it's very fuel efficient (45+ MPG) and it has more torque than a 330i. It's as quick off the line as my dad's E39 530i Auto. The E90 320d is even more powerful, more refined and it is an even better car. Also, in my experience BMW is way, way ahead of MB, Audi, VW and everyone else when it comes to diesel power. I think BMW should just start introducing these to the American market and wait it out until sales start to pick up. It will take a couple of years, but once everyone gets used to the idea that diesel is in fact pretty cool, they will sell diesels like hotcakes. I can’t see why Americans would not embrace these cars once they are introduced. I currently drive an E46 320d, and it is awesome. It is still seen as a premium car where I live (South Africa), even though it is 5 years old by now. It’s NOT dirty, it’s very fuel efficient (45+ MPG) and it has more torque than a 330i. It’s as quick off the line as my dad’s E39 530i Auto. The E90 320d is even more powerful, more refined and it is an even better car. Also, in my experience BMW is way, way ahead of MB, Audi, VW and everyone else when it comes to diesel power.

I think BMW should just start introducing these to the American market and wait it out until sales start to pick up. It will take a couple of years, but once everyone gets used to the idea that diesel is in fact pretty cool, they will sell diesels like hotcakes.

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